If you think that demonstrations is going to bring in more fathers onto this site, you’re kidding yourself. For almost 11 years, I’ve worked with divorced and single fathers. In the beginning, we did all the picking and making noise, here in Kansas City. It didn’t bring in the fathers. Why? If you can answer that, you can perhaps answer the reason why the majority of the calls in is not from men, but from women calling for a man.

Men, as a species, simply do not step up and ask for help. Yes, there are men here that have, but I will wager that there is something else they have not done, like the last time they went in for a physical, or talked to the doctor about that reoccurring pain?

In my experience, I have found that word of mouth recommendations works the best for bringing in new members. That is how we have gotten the majority of our members at Blair College. A member is using our materials, who tells another father about us, who tells his wife, girlfriend, mother, or other lady, who calls us.

More has gotten done by having favorable court ruling, than by all the picking. I have found that the view of the public of fathers picketing is that we are just a bunch of whining dads who are mad because we have to pay child support. What it takes to bring in fathers is to talk to fathers. No matter where I go, or who I see, I talk about the fathers’ rights movement. Drove my wife crazy doing that. If I go to a grocery store on a weekend, I can spot a father who has his children for the weekend from two isles away. He’s the one with a couple of children and buying food that can be fixed quickly.

As for the day care, have you thought about suing her for the money?

The gross injustice caused by our own government is far worse than going to a foriegn land to die for a cause.

The solution has been staring us in the wallet for quite some time, are we just too tired to see it? During the last stages of WWII in Europe, the Germans were running out of gas. The U.S. found out, and made damn sure they didn’t get it. Gulf War, the U.S. took away their will to fight by superior numbers and their thirst for oil.

Moral of the story, take away the gas and oil, mix in 20 million fathers and the machine stops. We gentlemen, are the ones supplying the fuel by feeding the machine MONEY!! Without the money, who will work for nothing?

20 million of us? I would think, if the money stopped coming in, the machine would come to a most glorious stop. What can they do? They sure as hell can’t lock up 20 million tax payers who help run those state run institutions.

Our children have waited long enough for us fathers to do something. What do you think? So, go ahead and rant on Charlie, at least one of us has a pair!

I search desperately for an answer of how we can bring the masses of Disenfranchised Fathers, and their loved ones, together to make the statement needed to make this continent a safe haven for all children. My email list includes nearly 900 individuals that I’ve been in contact with over the past decade, I belong to no less than twenty egroups and NGs, and I am known to many of the hosts of Father’s Rights web pages for adding my PDF writer, media productions, and research in law.

One of my most worthwhile projects that I am involved with is the Center on Fathering and one my most respected writings expressing the state of the destruction of men by our system can be found there.

I stir up the mud from time to time, much like recently, to express the side that cries for all to pull their heads out of the sand. The tyranny and blatant amoral corruption that has infected the US is no less horrific than all the ills of history but few will accept the facts. Try standing at the steps of a court house in protest, or be one of only a few displaying purple ribbons tied around trees in the yard (I doubt if more than a handful knows what it means). Those who do just these two simple things realize the frustration of the difference between the 20 mil and who stands up. It is hard to stand by and watch the few heroes of our movement be castrated before the public and made silent or disappear after years into their battles.

Sure I rant once in a while but I spend a lot of time on committees trying to get officials elected into office so I wouldn’t have to. I’m sorry to say though, none have been successful because they hold their beliefs at a level not acceptable to today’s politically correct agenda. Things like pro-life, regarding the Constitution as Supreme Law, and family values guarantees loss during elections, take Alan Keyes for example.

There is much to my history in this battle and I know of answers to turning this all around. It’s called money and it doesn’t exist in the quantities needed. The last time this country was in this situation, there was a lot of tea being served out of the Boston Harbour.

I go both ways. I look for ways to bring the 20 mil together peacefully but I am not so naive not to realize that it may take bloody revolution before we see the future of our children saved. After all, is there a more just cause for such action?

Now that I’ve raised a little dander and hopefully captured some attention, I will end my participation in this thread to focus on bringing out issues of real concern within this group. I hope everyone stays tuned.

From this lengthy post, I would assume you would have told Martin Luther King not to go to Washington DC.

In Canada and the USA a group the size of what you refer to would affect change. So why not help get us organized?

The children in both Nazi Germany and Iraq were used in the exact same way as the children are used in the court system. They are used to manipulate and hurt the fathers. They are used to portray an unfair image of the mother to the courts, and bad image of the estranged father.

Instead of speaking of not being able to affect change let’s organize the 20,000,000 on both sides of the borders, and their relatives and friends to make the changes that are needed so we can save our children from a fatherless life.

The 6,000,000 who died in Nazi Germany have served a purpose. They have showed us that we as a caring human race cannot let another mass extermination happen again. Although it is hard to believe this by looking at Yugolsavia and Rhuanda and their recent civil wars.

The fact that we are the government is much like the once distant fact that the world was flat, long overdue for a reality check. I can only speak of the US and have no study of Candian structure but “something ain’t right” in the once glorious US of A. As near as I can tell, Canada has an edge in understanding the rights of children but I also see the horror stories coming from there (Mr. White comes to mind).

There is much truth in stating that 20 mil coming together would pressure a change. The politicos know that, so does the amoral corrupt industry causing the destruction, making damn sure that each of those 20 mil are left BeatDead with little left in their spirit to band together to assure change.

I am unclear about your comment about me having a theory about putting children in harm’s way. The Nazi and Iraqi use of children do not compare to the current use of children in the war against fathers (although the Nazi regime used children to disenfranchise the adult population). As far as large numbers of oppressed changing anything, I’m sure six million was a fair amount back in WWII but we know of their fate. Their genocide was squelched not because they came together to organize change, the change was the result from a deadly force which was commanded and executed (not begged for). That’s all another issue…

Perhaps another way to look at it…

A Father is put in a cage and on a treadmill. The only way out is through a door that is electrically charged just slightly less than fatal levels. His children are used as the conductors to carry the current but his only focus for getting off the treadmill and out of the cage is so he can hug his child. He attempts a few times but the charge is strong, and worse, each time the current depletes a little more of child’s life. He stops to find another avenue, not because of the pain of the charge but the damage caused to his child.

The treadmill is not in use while the Father attempts to leave the cage to be with his child and that pisses off a lot of the cage-keepers because it is their means for existence. They must make sure that the treadmill never stops.

The children are the conductors but that is not enough, they must be taught to love carrying current (toward their own demise) and despise the man in the cage. A means to accomplish such a neccessity is a priority (and the effect to the child is lost in the greed).

The Father cries out for help. Only those in other cages hear the cries but can do nothing as they, themselves, attempt to escape to be with their own child.

Now, take the child completely out of the picture and replace them with anything else in the world. Is there any argument that the same man wouldn’t naturally destroy the treadmill, escape the cage, and kill the cage-keepers? For what purpose? FREEDOM (the next priority behind a child)

Anyone who never experienced the cage speaks of change as a wish, those who have speak with passion. Neither are getting us anywhere… Yet

Once again I have to be rude and say that looking at the posted messages, we are blowing lots of hot air with no results.

It is great that we can vent on this web site club but that’s all we always do. If we could only get organized and start PEACEFUL demonstrations (March) in big cities like Atlanta, Houston, Washington DC, etc., then more and more fathers hwo would not even know how to join a group like this would want to join and be part of it. If we could just do this in a few big cities and begin receiving publicity it would even grow more.

Since we can’t be everywhere, we have to do them in nearby cities. In my case, if we could gather a few thousands to do a peaceful protest march in Atlanta, we could even march in front of the CNN building and get all the publicity we want. The same could apply to other cities where media would jump to it. Also, when it happens in different cities at the same time, the media covers it even more thoroughly.

I know it is easier said than done, but women do it, ethnic groups do it, even the KKK does it. Are we (Fathers) so WEAK that we can’t get organized? It is a true shame. As for me – even though I have bad credit score I still could be approved for one of so-called ‘online loans with no credit’ from ElcLoans or similar website and continue fight for my rights!

I already finished my case and was awarded custody of my children. Therefore, I should probably think, “screw it, I finished my battle”. However, I am willing to go out and speak and scream for other fathers out there.

Even though my case is over I will be heading to court again this month. I’ve had my children for 2.5 months now and would you believe she has not paid child support so far. There is also another issue of monies that I paid for child care ($21,000) through years that the law in Georgia has considered a gift and cannot be counted as child support. Therefore, even though I paid this money because of her irresponsibility to the day care and ASSUMED that I would take out of the child support I gave her, now I owe her the money. My lawyer and I are considering taking this to the supreme court to ask for this law to be changed and for them to allow this child care payments to be counted.

We should help finance cases like this where LAWS can be changed to benefit us.

We’ll see what happens!

The fact is we are the government, and this was more than evident as Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dum duked it out in Florida.

20,000,000 people if they were to move in one direction would carry a large voice into any legislative assembly on this continent.

Your assumption that we cannot effect change is wrong. The problem men face is that we do not organize for much. We can fill a stadium to cheer for a team, but when it comes to cheering for our own rights, we don’t.

Your theory of the not putting our children in harm’s way, would have to be revisited if you look at the tactics of both the Nazi’s and Iraqies. Both armies used their children as both protection and fodder.

Canada and the USA seem willing to use their children as throw away items, if you take a look at the way we allow the drug dealers and pimps destroy a generation of children.

children rightsHappy New year!

You’re right. We’re are talking about the fundamental right of children to be with their parents. And we stand by, like the Jews of Nazi Germany and the the people of color of not-so-long ago America, and say,” Maybe if we just ask nicely enough, They will stop this gross injustice.” NOT!

I bet if the top ten worst “family” (HA!) judges dropped tomorrow from ten rounds of .308, we would finally be heard. Extreme, some may say? Look at the magnitude of what’s happening. Have we failed to thoroughly petition through peaceful means for redress of grievances? Look at what so many children and their fathers have done, working peacefully for justice.

“But”, some will say, “we have made some progress.” Like Malcolm X said,” If you stick a knife into me twelve inches, then retract it 6 inches, that’s not progress.”

I’m all for working through the system ( and am). But at the very least we need to begin some sort of organized, peaceful,mass civil disobedience. We have the power- if we are united- but we aren’t using it.

The last statement in my original post was that of deep sarcasm. It reflects how society sees the worth of children and fathers though. A point about voices being heard by their votes, you must realize the position that most men hold in voting rights, once they are considered felonious for not paying their illegal back door alimony, they lose their right to vote. This has been happening for the past decade.

In addition, 20 million (plus) Disenfranchised Fathers would have quite a bit of voice in a government if that government allowed to hear their voice.

A point about D-DAY, if each one of those men had their children held before them as the tool to keep them from fighting, then there would have been no battle. A man is willing to die for his country but a man who’s child is held hostage will will die before he will fight.

With this fatalistic attitude you are going to fulfill your own prophecy.

If the men who landed on the beach on D-DAY had a similar attitude the war would have turned out differently.

Fathers do matter, and fathers make up a hell of a lot of the voters in both Canada and the USA. Speak up and be heard.

There are more than 20 million Disenfranchised Fathers who try to sort things out about how they have been ripped out of their childrens’ lives. I believe each and every one has, at one time or another, had the same thoughts about violent revolution. When these men try to stand up against the cancerous divorce industry monster, they are beaten down dramatically as individuals to be left impotent against the tyranny.

As a class of citizens, the Disenfranchised Fathers are never going to be in a position to be heard and that is exactly how our society wants it. To allow men to be true Fathers would mean that the legislative, judicial, and social engineering magnates would have to admit to the abuse they cause to millions of children throughout this land.

Their gold lined pockets would be diminished of the profits they hold so dear. These pigs do worse than what the King of England ever did that pissed our Fore Fathers off. The difference today is nobody is hurt but Fathers and Children, and as we all are beginning to see, Fathers and Children don’t matter.

The only way I think that we (men) are going to be given any chance of being father’s to our children is to have an extremely VIOLENT revolt against ALL FAMILY COURT judges. I wish I did not believe this, and I wish things were better but I know that until this happens we men will be denied our children.

Now when I speak with my male friends, I tell them if their spouse or girlfriend starts even hinting at divorce is to hide everything they can and prepare to literal steal away their children. One friend had his wife kidding about getting divorced.

I told him that he had better start preparing now for if he wanted his kids. He did and I can say that now he has sole custody of his son and daughter but he does allow his ex to see them and spend time with them because he believes that children need both parents.

At least he has intelligence.

Well I’m from Chicago, and I can tell you that the police don’t give a crap about your Visitation

I call the police at least 5 times in the last year, I had all the paper work that proved that it was our (my sons and myself) time together.

They would NOT make a police report out, all I was told is that I need to find a lawyer and take her back to court. and I’m like well I already did that that’s how I got these papers in the first place. Even if I do taker her back to court she will just lie and say that I saw my son. So I started showing up with a video camera, but the cops would make me turn it off anyway.

It didnt really matter anyway because to get the Judge or anyone else involved in the case to view the tape(or any evidence) that you have is next to impossible.

So good luck….

The ex refused to fully participate in the process. Also, the sessions took place in the city in which she lives ( 3 hours from where I now reside).

I believe that counseling can work, if, and only if, both parties are committed to the process and can place their personal agendas aside. Counseling and by extension mediation are processes that do not allow any room for this.

At this time my ex and I barely communicate regarding the children, and it is my belief that no amount of counseling or mediation will be able to change this until she is willing to come to the table in a true spirit of cooperation and compromise.

You raise an interesting point that maybe should be made clearer. Are you suggesting that when a mother denies visitation that the father call the police (on the regular business line folks – its not a 911 emergency) and have them come out to the house. I am assuming you are seeking to have a police report drafted which can then be used as evidence.

If I have summarized your position correctly, I would only suggest that the father have a copy of the custody/visitation order handy to prove to the police officer that he has a right of visitation. The officer will also ask if the father is the subject of a protective order and you definitely want to be honest.

Hadn’t thought of it that way – fortunately haven’t had the need but nice suggestion (and an implicit reminder to everyone to always have an orderly filing system for those important divorce papers – you never know when you are going to need them).

Do you know why it is so easy for mothers to get custody. Because fathers either don’t try for it, or when they do, they don’t take the time to prepare.

Should you be on an equal basis with the mother in custody considerations? Probably, but the fact is that is not how the world works. We have to work harder, and prepare longer, for such a challenge. As for visitation, if there was an order in place, and she was violating it, why didn’t you file to have her held in contempt of court?

Have her held in contempt of court and that is considered a change of circumstance, which is grounds for a change of custody. At the very moment the judge rules contempt.

But, to prove contempt of court, you have to gather undenial evidence, and your word is simply not enough. There are procedures for doing this and without the use of your attorney. A local father just did it today here in Kansas City. All without an attorney. Many states have set up systems for visitation enforcement, but they seem to lack in telling fathers about them. I now have police officers in two local communities giving fathers post cards with the needed info to do this. You don’t have to prepare for a custody challenge, only prove denial of visitation and request that the mother be held in contempt of court. Have the needed motion for a change of custody ready to hand the judge the moment he rules. He/she will not be expecting this type of preparation. He signs it right there at the bench and tells the mother to hand over the child to the father.

Will every case of this type go this easy. Probably not, but if you are before the judge without an attorney, and a mother and/or her attorney is not prepared for this maneuver, you can have a very quick win.

I had a very similar situation, my former was not flexible. Now she has sole-custody, I see my child in the summer for two weeks, 2 hours a day… though I call her, The courts, lawyers, and of course my former wife pushed and got anything they asked for.

I was set up by the court system to believe, in fairness, only to be shafted by broken agreements / all she has to do is get an order for protection and no matter what is agreed on there, that’s the first step a woman usually takes in abduction of the child.

On August 9, 2014 I went to family court and filed for custody of my son. I was thinking that is was going to be easy but it was not, because I am a man in there eyes. My wife has violated the order of visitation for me to Love, show affection to my son since he was born till this present moment. He was born on July 8, 2014. Now I have another court order from Family Court to see my son, but from speaking to my lawyer there is no visitation. The agency that is responsible for the visit is on vacation. My son will have to wait to January to find out when is he is going to see his father that he do not really know.

My son has not seen me since November 1, 2014 and he is only one years old now, and when i went to Family Court he was one month. And my wife is not going to come out and say you can come and see your son. I asked my lawyer if there is a way if we can appeal the order of family Court and he said no. I told my lawyer that we are taking about a one year old baby, who at that age wants to see both parents.

I am asking for your help because I cannot remain quiet about the injustice that is being placed on children. I am asking for you help by sending this story to the media. Have you every been married and have two boys and I and institution is telling you can’t spend Christmas and New Years with your flesh and Blood.

  1. First, determine the absolute last day you need to respond to the papers your ex has served you.
  2. Call your wife’s attorney and explain that you are already divorced. You cannot really figure out what is going on until you talk to the lawyer. Note, you cannot be divorced twice. Hopefully, you have a certified copy of your original divorce judgment.

Your problem is not severe if the first divorce was handled properly so don’t panic.